Balance Issues when Stopping

[mouthpiec]

Originally Posted by aeagles

I had a tough time in the MSF putting my left foot down at stops as I came off a scooter to the m50 - and the scoot had no foot brake, so either foot was fine. What I figured out was that as I come to a stop, pressing "a little" with my left hand makes the bike lean to the left (like countersteering in a turn), kind-of forcing left foot down first. try it. it works great.

I think that this is a good idea!!
I will try it out!

[ksievers]

all good advice here so far of course..

IF there truly is no MSF or similar course available where you live, do you know, or can you get to know, someone who is really good/natural at handling his/her bike? there is no substitute for seeing someone handle a bike well in person, and having someone watch you in person. Avoid hot-dog riders of course, but generally people are happy to help - and a session or two with someone who is really intuitive at slow speed handling may give you a very valuable and new perspective. Get with someone and go to a big parking lot where there are no distractions and nothing to run into.

good luck -

[womper]

I was riding around town last night and I think i know what might help you...

try to be 'loose' on the bike... don't be stiff. you just need to balance yourself on top of the bike and when you are rigid you move too much from the bike, and any corrections you make are amplified i think...

just relax, don't try to kill the grips, hold the bike with your knees like it's a money-bag and practice..

even after taking a course it took me many miles to get comfortable...

[CaptCrashIdaho]

Wierd question: you aren't looking down at your hands as you stop are you? Sounds wierd but lots of newer riders look at thier hands and that screws up your balance...

[sra4031]

Originally Posted by CaptCrashIdaho

Wierd question: you aren't looking down at your hands as you stop are you? Sounds wierd but lots of newer riders look at thier hands and that screws up your balance...

Or feet either

[mouthpiec]

Originally Posted by CaptCrashIdaho

Wierd question: you aren't looking down at your hands as you stop are you? Sounds wierd but lots of newer riders look at thier hands and that screws up your balance...

No no, that was one of the first think ma instructor told me .... to look always forward.

[CaptCrashIdaho]

That's cool. It's just an instinctive thing that can happen. Another possibility is that as you apply the front brake you're pushing or pulling on the handlebars as you squeeze the brake lever. Try to keep the bars straight.

Other than that, just keep working on it. You might find an empty parking lot and practice some there!

[mouthpiec]

Originally Posted by CaptCrashIdaho

That's cool. It's just an instinctive thing that can happen. Another possibility is that as you apply the front brake you're pushing or pulling on the handlebars as you squeeze the brake lever. Try to keep the bars straight.

I think that I was pushing the front brake to hard and make the tyre skid!

[Rebel Rider]

New rider myself, I had some trouble with using both brakes. I would suggest that you do some slow practice, meaning you are moving like about 5 mph working the clutch to learn the friction zone. Also when you are going to stop do NOT put your foot down before you stop, or you just might lose a foot. You have to trust yourself and the m/c learn to come to a complete stop. A exercise we did in basic riding course was quick stop, pick a place where you can mark some way ( about ten feet ) then you have m/c going about 15mph, once you cross your marked place apply "BOTH" brakes at same time. This will help you learn how to apply the brakes quickly and effectively. It will help you gain what you need out on the street. The idea is to use everything together (clutch, down shift gear, back brake and front brake), this is a great exercise. Just note you want to use more front brake then back brake, the back brake will make you skid some if you are use it to much. If you give this a try you will see how the front will bow down and come back up, you will feel it this is when you know you are using you brakes correctly. I have done this exercise over the last 2 weeks and used out on the street so I can say it works. Let me know if you give it a try.

[Oaksong]

Originally Posted by Easy Rider

After a LOT of riding and practice, most people can "hold" with the front brake and still start out smoothly. Some are never able to accomplish that but are still skilled and competent riders.

Not if you practice. I live on a hill so I need to be able to do that a lot. I have gotten pretty good at it in the ~1month I have been riding. It helps a lot to adjust the front brake lever so that you can just barely pull it in while getting some extra throttle.

[Davecm203]

Originally Posted by Oaksong

Not if you practice. I live on a hill so I need to be able to do that a lot. I have gotten pretty good at it in the ~1month I have been riding. It helps a lot to adjust the front brake lever so that you can just barely pull it in while getting some extra throttle.

It is easier and safer to simply use the back brake.

[Easy Rider]

Originally Posted by Oaksong

Not if you practice.

What ?? You know every bike rider in the world and can somehow divine that they can learn to do that if they practice enough??

I can assure you that some people ride a LOT of miles for a LOT of years and never quite get the clutch and throttle timing just right. They have no chance of working clutch, throttle AND front brake together.

Believe whatever you want, I have seen it......more than once.

[MikeHump]

I'd say that unless you're doing some really hard braking (emergency braking) or riding on a track, if you're in the correct gear, engine compression should put enough braking force to the rear wheel to safely bring you to a stop while using the front brake. Your front brake can do anywhere from 70% to 80% of your stopping force. I generally slightly apply my rear brake just before I apply my front brake in order to settle the rear end, and then I'll release the rear brake and just use engine compression along with the front brake to stop my bike as long as it's not an emergency stop.

Also, if you apply the front brake too hard BEFORE you apply the rear brake, your weight will shift too far forward, giving you less traction to the rear wheel (less weight on the rear tire). If you do this, and THEN apply the rear brake, there is a higher chance of you locking up the rear due to the lower amount of traction at the rear tire.

[womper]

the above confuses me...

if the back wheel has no downward force on it... why use it then? no weight on back wheel will cause it to lock up more easily...

[MikeHump]

Originally Posted by womper

the above confuses me...

if the back wheel has no downward force on it... why use it then? no weight on back wheel will cause it to lock up more easily...

I think you misunderstood. I didn't say there was ZERO traction at the rear wheel, but less traction if you apply the front brake first because of the fact that the rear spring will unload when weight is shifted forward. It's just that when you apply the front brake first, due to physics the weight of the bike in motion that wants to stay in motion moves forward, compressing the front forks and extending the rear suspension.

You should go out and try it, it's a lot easier to understand when you actually do it than with me trying to explain it online hahaha. Get to speed (however fast you want) and squeeze the front brake first, let the front forks compress and then apply the rear brake until it locks up. Then, get up to the same speed, slightly apply the rear brake first, then the front brake, and then after the front brake is applied, apply more pressure to the rear until it locks up. You should notice that it takes more effort to lock up the rear brake if you apply it prior to the front brake because it will load the rear end and give it more traction. When you apply the rear brake first (as long as you do not over-apply it), the rear end squats, giving you more traction at the rear wheel.

Hopefully I explained it better this time around.

[womper]

heh... i think so..

i think that's what i do...

rear brake and weight transfers to the front, which i slowly increase my front brake and slowly decrease the back brake...

works for me anyhow...

[Davecm203]

Originally Posted by womper

the above confuses me...

if the back wheel has no downward force on it... why use it then? no weight on back wheel will cause it to lock up more easily...

When you are ridding next time apply just your back brake and you notice that the bike will squat. Then apply just the front brake and you will notice that the back end will come up and the front will dip more. As he said, if you apply the back brake properly, it will squat and not pitch as much. It will keep more weight on the back and you will get more braking from it. The bike will also be easier to control.

[womper]

i'll stick to the way i stop... works for me

back first, front with back, increasing front while decreasing back...
i rarely ever lockup

[Davecm203]

never mind.

[MikeHump]

Originally Posted by womper

back first, front with back, increasing front while decreasing back...

Hahaha that's basically the same thing that we're saying. We were just explaining WHY that helps from locking up the rear tire. Just breakin it down for ya.