Gravel... on the brakes

[Fox]

What was I thinking before and after...? Was it the right action in mere seconds?

Here is a quick summary, I wipped out at the exiting when I drifted wide off the road. The turn was a 45 degree left turn, entry and the exit being nearly identical in curvature, and tightest point at the mid section.

To make the long story short, when I was coming around the turn, there was gravel on the road. I looked to see at which point is clear of gravel to guide the front wheel through while lean over. The gravel was stretched from outside white line to the yellow. Immediately, next thought was reduce lean angle, then brakes came on. Here, I'm pretty sure it was reaction to NO SAFE ROUTE.

1) I realize now in a panic situation, I'm calm. Front and rear brakes were pressed with gentle touch, while fully leaned over, and quickly decreased lean.

2) When bars where shaking, I noticed the index and the middle finger were still adding pressure lightly, while other 3 were holding on gently. I realize now though, with the front hopping, then shaking, fronts did little to stop me. The rear never locked, and it was held gently.

3) Tire washed out and I began to fall to left, I let go.

After some thought, I learned that, in panic situation, I retain good assessment of rider input at the controls. However, my decision to brake may have been the bad one.

I learned, why didn't I consider running over my line and cross over the yellow lines and aviod this whole scenario. Sure, my knee was out gauging the lean angle, I could have lean it farther.

I came to learn little more about the way I think. I've trained my mind to never cross over double yellow lines during intense twisties. The thought of digging deeper into the inside corner never occured to me. I believe, I could have made it if I had taken it earlier to the inside.

In other words, change my line of attack and drive out at different line. With an early decision to do so, I would have looked into that inside line for uncoming traffic beforehand and make the steering correction.

[Fox]

Oh this is where you guys were supposed to come in say, you idiot learn to stay on the road.

[007]

Nobody wants to be seen as rude or condescending...so thank you for saying it for us
It's good that you are OK though. The other day in another forum someone lost a leg...really sad and scary.

[Fox]

Sorry to hear that. What happened?

[007]

I forgot to say that (since I'm a rookie) I go out on road scouting missions before I actually ride. I drive the cage around and study the road: where the potholes, manholes, cracks, sand etc. - how sharp the curves are - stuff like that. Then when I go riding, I already know the road conditions, so I don't get ugly surprises. So now all my attention is on my riding technique and on the cars around me.
You shouldn't lean blindly into curves if you don't know what's on the other side ...but I guess you've learned a valuable lesson now.

[007]

There was this guy on a Kawasaki forum, (apparently quite experienced rider), he slid out in a curve (kind of like you did, but at high speeds), crashed through the railing and one of his legs could not be saved. He will live, but no leg.... terrible

makes me think of the saying my teacher said to me. if you get in a crash, you better hope you die, cause it aint gonna be pretty.

[Fox]

Originally Posted by 007

I forgot to say that (since I'm a rookie) I go out on road scouting missions before I actually ride. I drive the cage around and study the road: where the potholes, manholes, cracks, sand etc. - how sharp the curves are - stuff like that. Then when I go riding, I already know the road conditions, so I don't get ugly surprises. So now all my attention is on my riding technique and on the cars around me.
You shouldn't lean blindly into curves if you don't know what's on the other side ...but I guess you've learned a valuable lesson now.

I went back to the crash site and looked over the road. It could have been far worse. I was really lucky I didn't drift off just a few feet more. I would have run off the side ditch and hit this big round concrete drainage thing partially exposed from the ground. I noticed bunch of stuff I never saw.

As you mentioned, fear of gravel had me scanning both sides of the lane. That's probably the most important thing learned from that day.

[TL chris]

I just found out today, one of my fellow Airmen just lost his foot in a motorcycle accident. From what I'm told, he was in the fast lane on the highway, following the speed limit. Next to his lane a big F-350 decided to merge either without looking, or without regard to my friend. He came from about a 45 degree angle and hit the right side of the bike with the left corner of his bumper. Ran him right into the guardrail. His foot was severed just above the ankle. Barely hanging on by a few threads of skin. He was rushed to the local hospital in Davis, CA. They stabilized him and his foot, and sent him to the local military hospital. They couldn't help him, and sent him (to the third freakin' hospital) to Sacramento. This was about 2 weeks ago. They reattached his foot and hoped it would take. At first it was looking good, but today they said it couldn't be saved. I don't know if he was wearing racing boots or not. Please keep this wonderful defender of our country in your thoughts for him and his family during this difficult time. Sorry for the long post, but I hope it serves as a reminder that there are always bad and inattentive drivers out there. You are not invincible. Be aware of your surroundings and please ride safe and wear your gear.

its too bad. there goes his airforce career. unless he was a desk jockey or something along the lines of that. what do you do chris?

[TL chris]

I won't tell what I do, But he's an airplane mechanic. Damn good one too.

[LayinLo]

definitely another post on importance of gear. I need some good boots. Any suggestions on your favorite boots? Do I size them like normal shoes?

[98G]

Originally Posted by LayinLo_usmc

definitely another post on importance of gear. I need some good boots. Any suggestions on your favorite boots? Do I size them like normal shoes?

//Joe Rocket Speedmaster or Hard Drive boots. Sized like normal shoes. Cost around $200.

98G

[Gixxerdale]

Originally Posted by LayinLo_usmc

definitely another post on importance of gear. I need some good boots. Any suggestions on your favorite boots? Do I size them like normal shoes?

Sizing depends on the manufacturer. Best to try before you buy. Got a Cycle Gear near by?
Huge choice depends on personal preference. Alpinestars SMX are my current choice for my type of riding. Sidi's are a nice too, but run narrower. I have some Teknic highway boots for the short hops.

[DrBob]

Originally Posted by Fox

I learned, why didn't I consider running over my line and cross over the yellow lines and aviod this whole scenario. Sure, my knee was out gauging the lean angle, I could have lean it farther.

Yes, this is always your best option for dealing with patches of loose gravel in the road: look past them and not at them, crack the throttle open a bit more, counter-steer and dive inside them. I'd rather scrape up my knee and footpegs than lay the bike down. I always advise people to find a dirt or gravel road and spend an afternoon playing around; this will really boost your confidence as you learn to control the bike on a loose footing.

Glad you are OK.

[dmdan]

Ok,
I got the answer but it is super wierd. If you are leaning to the left, pretty severely, and your front tire starts loosing traction or slides, what you want to do is turn more into the slide. In other words, counter steer. It should be a normal reaction just as long as you keep holding onto the bars!.

Basically a simpler explaination is:
The tire slips as your taking a left hand leaning turn.
Keep the tire going into the turn, so push the right hand grip or turn the bars into the skid (pull the left bar).
As you do this the skidding wheel will straighten just a bit and grab.
Be ready to striaghten the bike as quick as it wants to jump up.
No brakes, no gas, no panic.

[LayinLo]

Tahnx Gdale and 98G...I'll probably have to get them online.

[Fox]

Originally Posted by dmdan

Ok,
I got the answer but it is super wierd. If you are leaning to the left, pretty severely, and your front tire starts loosing traction or slides, what you want to do is turn more into the slide. In other words, counter steer. It should be a normal reaction just as long as you keep holding onto the bars!.

Basically a simpler explaination is:
The tire slips as your taking a left hand leaning turn.
Keep the tire going into the turn, so push the right hand grip or turn the bars into the skid (pull the left bar).
As you do this the skidding wheel will straighten just a bit and grab.
Be ready to striaghten the bike as quick as it wants to jump up.
No brakes, no gas, no panic.

Wouldn't this be like counter-counter steering? 1) To steer left, right bar is pulled and left bar is pushed, deflecting the wheel to the right making the bike dive left. So if I push the right bar, left is being pulled, in essence, turning the bike right into the direction of the skid.