Myths About Drilling in ANWR

[omegajim]

don't think I'll see it my lifetime.

[Sgt Mike]

Originally Posted by omegajim

I think there are many alternatives that can be utilized with the technology that has come online in the last few years.

drilling for more oil is a good short term strategy, but long term the answer has to be diversified.

[Clint]

Originally Posted by Sgt Mike

YES

So do it! It's your stinkin' thread!

Edit: I see Annie's already done it. I'm going to merge the two to keep this tidy.

[womper]

Originally Posted by omegajim

I find it amusing that Canada is doing more to extract oil from their shale than we are.

we have more land mass to spoil

[inspiron]

There would be a huge payoff to anyone who could invent/develop a replacement fuel. The problem with all of the solutions today is that you are trading one "evil" for another.

I was just reading an article where they were comparing the "total environmental impact" of modern Hybrids versus traditional gasoline cars. The conclusion of the author was that a 7 year-old gasoline car has less environmental impact, if you take into account the amount of energy and raw materials required by the vehicle over it's entire lifespan.

A VW Golf with a standard, 1.6 liter gasoline engine requires something like 22 tons of material to produce. The fuel, rubber and oil it uses during it's "productive" life is just a fraction of the total energy (and environmental impact). More than half of the overall energy is expended just to produce the parts. Ore must be extracted from the earth, trucked to a foundry, melted and processed into steel, copper, aluminum, etc. This requires HUGE amounts of energy.

A new Toyota Prius contains MUCH more copper wire for the hybrid engine, which significantly increases the overall energy required by the car over it's lifetime. Sure, the car pumps out less CO2, but the factories and foundries required to produce that additional copper are pumping out more CO2 than a Prius will "save" over it's life.

[frostbitevinnie]

I'm recalling my several trips to Easter Europe. Very few folks drive cars, just too expensive and public transportation is prolific as well as doing the old walking thing. I like public transportation but in my area it would take me more than an hour to travel 6 miles. Too much time wasted for it to be worth the $33/mo ticket.

As far as energy saving I have been preparing for years. Super insulated my home, high efficiency windows, and we use fans considerably more than AC. Shades on all E and S windows. I burn wood for heat in winter using what is freely available from my nearby cabinet shop. Yep, 90% of my heat fuel is free, 10% I purchase split hardwood, well I do have to take the time to drive the 1/2 mile to the shop, load the truck up then unload and stack. Also after storms I will drive around the city looking for fallen trees and large limbs. Usually the homeowner wants these removed and my offer to remove it for free and haul it away is much more attractive than the offer from the tree man at $500 to $1000/tree. My expense, fuel for my truck [minimal] fuel for my chain saw [minimal] headache and back ache [expensive]

MY Hyundai get 31 city and 37 hwy, could be better I suppose but better than a great majority of vehicles out there.

As I have said before I have invested heavily in oil which has been a very profitable choice. I make enough in my regular trading account with div. to fully fund our IRA's every year.

Clint is absolutely correct we are paying for our past gluttony. Folks are "suffering" now due to their lack of foresight to prepare for "high" energy cost. Most folks have designed their lifestyle dependency around high energy needs with no backup plan. I suppose someday when my neighbors cannot pay for their winter fuel I will be getting a knock on my door since I will be the only one among thousands that will be enjoying the fruits of my labor and foresight. Ahhhhh, free heat is good, high energy expense bad.

As far as ANWAR my understanding is the area that would be impacted would be the equivalent size of a postage stamp on a football field. Minimal and well worth the effort, should have been done 20 years ago though. I have heard "experts" comparing ANWAR crude to the typical Saudi, Canuk, Mexican crude. ANWAR crude is the Rolls Royce of crude. It supposedly is of such a high quality that refining cost are very low in comparison to the typical crude. It is of the quality that rocket fuels are made from. Apparently to make such volatile pure fuels takes a much greater refining process and cost from your typical crude.

[inspiron]

I did mention that my apartment uses heating oil, but I also have a wood-burning stove in the living room which is used often during the winter months.

My car gets about 35 mpg (diesel) and my bike close to 40 mpg right now. At the current fuel prices, riding my BIKE costs me 10 cents PER KILOMETER - I filled the tank yesterday (at the 350 km mark) and it cost me $35.00. Riding the bike into the office and back home (without any other errands) is 54 kms roundtrip. That's $5.40 per day for fuel alone. Taking an average 20 working days per month, thats $108.00.

Driving down to the train station is 8 km roundtrip = $16.00 per month, plus the $67.00 for the train pass = $83.

So I save $25 per month taking public transportation. Not to mention the other benefits (lower mileage on my vehicles, lower stress for me since I'm not sitting in traffic, etc.).

[baltimorebayside]

Originally Posted by Easy Rider

Son of a B......
OK, I guess blatantly biased politics is not off limits here..........

So, what's our choice: An economically brain dead Democrat who somehow through an ultimate stupidity ends up making all the sweet and innocent Republicans richer than they have EVER BEEN in the history of our country
OR
A brain dead Republican who takes us into an ill-advised war that is KILLING people unnecessarily and is costing us TRILLIONS of dollars that we are BORROWING from foreign countries and is presiding over making the Republicans richer than they have ever been in history.

All politicians are ignorant, selfish, back-biting SOBs and anybody who thinks one side is better than the other is a raging idiot.

So there !!

This isn't my quote from me, it's from the article I found on the internet. I just thought it was interesting........

I also agree, it's both sides of the political party, however, isn't the democraps the ones preventing us from drilling in our own soil?

YES..........

nuf said....

dan

[inspiron]

Going into the democrat vs. republican debate will just get this thread closed down - which is probably what ER is trying to achieve anyway

If you guys want to debate the upcoming presidential elections, that's fine. Just don't do it here. This is an international motorcycle community - there are all walks of life represented here, and we're just a big happy family. A sure-fire way to start an argument at any family gathering is to begin discussing politics.

My political views are very moderate. I don't accept the ultra-socialist crap from the left and the ultra-conservative crap from the right. My (soon-to-be) brother-in-law is a lawyer and a politician, and he is an active member of the conservative party in Germany. I don't agree with him on many topics, so I chose not to discuss those topics with him.

Let's just leave it like that here.

[Easy Rider]

Originally Posted by inspiron

Going into the democrat vs. republican debate will just get this thread closed down - which is probably what ER is trying to achieve anyway

Let's just leave it like that here.

Yes, let's.
And the best way to do that is to not let it START.
If the bashing continues I will participate.

At this point, it would appear that the rules are being selectively enforced.
One side is allowed to start and continue a "discussion", bashing and insults included. When the other side gets fed up and speaks up, THEN it is labeled as disruptive and shut down.

I just don't think this is right.

[inspiron]

Okay, ER, your wish is my command.

This time.

THREAD CLOSED.