Roger,
You are correct in your assumptions about the TourMaster Venture pants. I have had a pair for 2 years and I absolutely love them. They come with a liner, but I have never used it. In temps 35°(F) or lower I do need to add a pair on long johns under my Dockers, and on the other end of the thermometer, the max I want to ride with these on is about 72-73°. Any higher and I start to sweat. I should mention that I'm 5'8" and 153, so I don't carry a lot of ... ahem ... insulation.
Hope this helps.
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-Sandman
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